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Box and/or Nest RelocationFrom: Jennifer Hoffman jhoffman"at"sal.wisc.edu Hi all, Quick call for advice here: I've had a backyard bluebird pair around all winter, and they've recently shown interest in one of my boxes. Since we've had cold weather right up until a couple of days ago, I hadn't unsealed the boxes or done any spring maintenance on them before now. Today I found a nest in their box, about half completed -- hooray! But I also found that the woodpeckers who roosted there over the winter chipped away at the inside of the box until some screw points were exposed. I would like to replace this box with another one (same design, and I can make the switch quickly). The question is, should I do it now or wait till I see an egg? At that point I know the female is more attached to the nest site, but also I fear that if she perceives a disturbance then, it might mean a longer delay until she can start over. Presumably, a disturbance in nest-building is not as big a deal. Of course I hope to cause NO disturbance, but am wondering which is safer, just in case. What do you think? Jennifer, S WI Pine Bluff Observatory To: bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L) On Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:22:56 -0500 (CDT) Jennifer Hoffman jhoffman"at"sal.wisc.edu
writes: ... I think it is better to make the switch then to have your Bluebirds
get cut on the screws. Maynard Sumner NABS MBS GAS OBS OBC NAHC NAFC Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. From: Jennifer Hoffman jhoffman"at"sal.wisc.edu
Thanks, Maynard -- I was thinking mostly of the young birds in the nest, but of course the screws might be dangerous for the adults too. I should also have mentioned that I plan on moving the existing
partial nest into the new box, and preserving its orientation
with respect to the entrance hole and the box's orientation
with respect to its surroundings. Jennifer, S WI Pine Bluff Observatory Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2002 22:39:02 -0400 Haleya Priest Amherst MA Jennifer Hoffman wrote: Hi all, ... From: "greenacres001" greenacres001"at"msn.com Hi Jennifer, I write for the main newspaper in Reno and am working on an article tonight about how it is illegal to mess with bird nests after the first egg is laid. A lot of people don't know that! We have a Canada goose in a nest in a 100-year-old cottonwood
that was slated to come down this week, but due to the heavy
fines coming from the migratory bird treaty act (and the fact
that they're being nice), the tree "owners" have backed
down until the goslings are hatched and fledged. It's the law. P.S. Thanks to everyone who responded to my plea about combatting house sparrows for my western bluebirds. I plan to use the monofilament technique first. True to form, the bluebird pairs came by the nests tonight at disk and checked things out ... I'm optimistic! ----- Original Message ----- ... From: TomGaryH"at"aol.com This spring I changed the front access to a wide-bodied "Peterson" nestbox after a bluebird had completed her nest (eggs had not been layed). Eggs were layed in it shortly after the change and now there are nestlings in the box. The new access has the small oval entrance as compared to the large ovals used in the north. The door that was replaced had been pecked out in the fall of 2000 by a red-bellied woodpecker so that it could use the box as a roost as it has done for two winters. So, by alternating the access door, which causes a change in nestbox appearance, there isn't too much time during the year that one or the other of the birds is not using the box. Anytime during the nesting season I have made changes that require considerable time to accomplish or that will change the appearance of a nestbox, I have insured beforehand the availability and functioning of the required tools and I've gone through the whole operation in my mind. Then, usually, I make the changes after dark. In your case I would wait until the nest is complete because there is normally a period of days between completion of the nest and deposition of eggs. If you can accomplish the change during this time, there will not be a chance for egg breakage. Tom Heintzelman Date: Wed, 10 Apr 2002 17:01:21 -0500 At 08:22 PM 4/9/02 -0500, Jennifer Hoffman wrote: Hi all, ... If the female abandons the nest during nest-building, she could end up dumping eggs in another nest, or start laying in a hastily constructed, partially built nest. It depends on whether she has actually begun the egg-laying cycle. Is there any way you could back the screws out a little bit so the points aren't exposed, but they still hold the nestbox together? That way you could leave the nestbox alone until after fledging, then do any necessary repairs or replacement. Kate Oschwald Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2002 13:38:00 -0400 When should you move nestboxes having no activity? We placed 8 boxes this year on a berm which is about 20 feet tall and 150 yards wide and 1/2 mile long. We continue to see EABL investigating the boxes, and foraging on the berm. However, 7 of the 8 boxes have had no nesting activity, and the 8th has only a partial, inactive nest. Box spacing is at least 100 yards. The berm is covered with mowed centipede grass. A few young, live oaks are located along the top. On one side of the berm is a pine forest. On the other side are homes. Many of the homeowners have nestboxes, and nesting EABL. We thought the berm should be ideal territory for EABL, but the EABL seem to think differently. About 50% of the other 37 boxes on our trail have activity, with the first eggs having been laid March 20. (We have had some cold weather off and on in March this year). Is this too soon to be discouraged? It seems that our customers, the EABL, aren't responding to our offering. We could place the boxes elsewhere on the trail where we have had success. Dawes Miller Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2002 15:36:41 -0500 At 01:38 PM 4/16/02 -0400, Dawes and Joan wrote: ... I would give the birds a little more time. Sometimes they take awhile to decide on the best spot, or they may decide to use these new nestboxes for the second or third nesting. Kate Oschwald From: "paul kilduff" plkldf"at"hotmail.com Paul Kilduff, Baltimore MD I have just gotten Message from naturalist at our park saying I have to move boxes even if they have eggs in them, and I believe at least one does have EABL eggs in it, and the other has a TRES nest. Turns out there's more jurisdiction than he told me about when I asked him in late winter where I could put them. I'm going to call him but want to post this to list for any helpful advice/experience you might have. I'm on Digest so cc to plkldf"at"hotmail.com appreciated... Paul From: "Bill Darnell" bdarnel3"at"bellsouth.net Paul, isn't this against the Federal laws? Are Bluebirds considered a migratory bird by law? There are some fights going on with Martin landlords right now, and that is the point some are using, successfully, for the time. Bill TN
... Date: Fri, 3 May 2002 17:23:30 -0500 (Central Daylight
Time) Here is section 16 of the migratory bird act. they can not legally be moved. Phil Berry Gulf Breeze, Florida Unless and except as permitted by regulations made as hereinafter provided in this subchapter, it shall be unlawful at any time, by any means or in any manner, to pursue, hunt, take, capture, kill, attempt to take, capture, or kill, possess, offer for sale, sell, offer to barter, barter, offer to purchase, purchase, deliver for shipment, ship, export, import, cause to be shipped, exported, or imported, deliver for transportation, transport or cause to be transported, carry or cause to be carried, or receive for shipment, transportation, carriage, or export, any migratory bird, any part, nest, or eggs of any such bird, or any product, whether or not manufactured, which consists, or is composed in whole or part, of any such bird or any part, nest, or egg thereof, included in the terms of the conventions between the United States and Great Britain for the protection of migratory birds concluded August 16, 1916 (39 Stat. 1702), the United States and the United Mexican States for the protection of migratory birds and game mammals concluded February 7, 1936, the United States and the Government of Japan for the protection of migratory birds and birds in danger of extinction, and their environment concluded March 4, 1972 (FOOTNOTE 1) and the convention between the United States and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics for the conservation of migratory birds and their environments concluded November 19, 1976. Date: Fri, 03 May 2002 18:51:01 -0400 Paul, some details of the Migratory Bird Treaty Act and some examples. This is from the USGS website. Note that it includes even nests without eggs. Technically, what we do as monitors can violate the Act, as "there is no requirement to prove intent". However, one important distinction is the end result of the action. Also note in the example, that even pursuing the parent birds, causing them to abandon the nest, is "killing" of the eggs. Pam in Harford County, Maryland -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Migratory Bird Treaty Act Wording in the Act makes it very clear that most actions that
result in "taking" or possession (permanent or temporary)
of a protected species can be a violation. Specifically, the
Act states: Unless and except as permitted by regulations . . . it shall be unlawful at any time, by any means, or in any manner to pursue, hunt, take, capture, kill...possess, offer for sale, sell...purchase...ship, export, import . . .transport or cause to be transported . . . any migratory bird, any part, nest, or eggs of any such bird . . . included in the terms of the conventions between the United States and Great Britain (acting for Canada)...the United States and the United Mexican States . . . and the United States and the Government of Japan" (emphasis added). The word "take" is defined as meaning "to pursue, hunt, shoot, wound, kill, trap, capture, or collect, or attempt to pursue, hunt, shoot, wound, kill, trap, capture, or collect" (50 CFR 10.12). The provisions of the Act are nearly absolute; "except
as permitted by regulations" is the only exception (Cogging
and Patti 1979). Examples of permitted actions that do not violate
the law are the possession of a hunting license to pursue specific
gamebirds, legitimate research activities, display in zoological
gardens, bird-banding, and similar activities. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What Might be a Violation of the Act? There are a number of incidents involving rails, birders, and violations of the Act. Several examples of Black Rails (Laterallus jamaicensis) being pursued, captured, and photographed in the hand exist for the eastern and western seaboards of the U.S. In the mid-1970s, a group of Wisconsin birders chased a Yellow Rail (Coturnicops noveboracensis) around a sandy area in Milwaukee harbor. Eventually, the exhausted rail was stepped on by an overly enthusiastic human. The "take" provision of the Act was violated by the attempted capture and killing of the bird. A practice used by some birders to view hole-nesting birds is to repeatedly hit the side of a nest tree, causing the adult birds to leave the hole. This activity can be considered "taking" if the bird is intentionally chased from its nest and the inadvertent death of young birds or abandonment of eggs occurs. Santa Ana National Wildlife Refuge in Texas hosted a Golden-crowned
Warbler (Basileuterus culicivorus) and a Yellow-faced Grassquit
(Tiaris olivacea) from late January to early February 1990.
Excessive pressure by birders caused refuge personnel to cordon
off an area of the refuge frequented by the grassquit to ensure
some protection of both the vegetation and the grassquit. Despite
the site's being prominently fenced, numerous birders crossed
over the cordon, trampling and destroying vegetation. Their
behavior may have ultimately caused the birds (both the warbler
and grassquit) to depart the area. Although no violation of
the Act occurred, these activities took place on a National
Wildlife Refuge in violation of the National Wildlife Refuge
System Administration Act of 1966 (16 U.S.C. 668dd-668ee; 80 Although the Act does not specifically prohibit harassment
to view birds, it is a different matter with the ESA. The ESA
specifically prohibits people from harassing endangered or threatened
species. In general, intentional or negligent actions that cause
an endangered or threatened species to significantly change
its normal behavior patterns (e.g., nesting, feeding, -----Original Message----- ... Date: Sat, 04 May 2002 13:31:44 -0500 At 08:52 PM 5/3/02 +0000, you wrote: Paul Kilduff, Baltimore MD ... Maybe you should remind him about the federal laws against messing with active nests of native species! Kate Oschwald From: "paul kilduff" plkldf"at"hotmail.com Paul Kilduff, Baltimore MD Thank you very much to all correspondents on this issue. Much appreciate the responses! One suggestion was moving boxes a few feet a day away towards where park manager wants them. They're on telescoping poles so I hope(?) I can put in a new base say, five feet away, then gently transfer the pole to the new base. I relocated the box which had nothing in it. Together this should show good faith. Thoughts welcome.... Paul From: chicker"at"snet.net Since taking down bluebird box/ nest due to sparrows. i kept the nest and box and was thinking of putting it up elsewhere..Bluebirds had deserted it due to sparrows.. Is the nest still good or if they go to a new box in a different area do they prefer to rebuild???/ Nest is clean not used....Also have some blues in the field ready to fledge should i get rid of the nest quickly or leave it for new tenants???? Any suggestions Bea in Bethel Connecticut From: TomGaryH"at"aol.com Bea, Regarding relocation of the box containing a nest that was taken down due to house sparrows, take the nest out of the box and put the nest in a coffee can or plastic bag and hardboard box so that you will have it as a replacement if an active nest becomes wet or infested with blowfly then relocate the box atfer it has been brushed out and titivated. Wait.....Wait.......Gota catch my breath. ..........OK, next box: After the birds fledge check the nestbox and nest. If these are suitable to you, you may want to leave everything in place. However, it is generally a good idea to remove the nest and discard it in an area far, far away from the nestbox. Most of the little birds I've monitored practice painting so I wire brush the inside of a box between clutches/broods since I have few boxes to tend. I make sure drain holes are cleared of dirt and debris and that there are no insects in the box then the access door is closed and secured and everything is ready for the next bunch. At the end of the season the boxes are given a more thorough cleaning and either stored or fitted out for winter roosting birds. Tom Heintzelman ----------------- Backyard Nestbox Landlord
Milton, Santa Rosa County, FL (western panhandle, inland) U.S.A.
------- Original Message ------- ... From: "carol fitzpatrick" gdfitzmich"at"msn.com I thought I had experienced just about everything as far as
bluebirds are concerned, but now a new problem has arisen. I
have a pair of nest boxes in a 30 acre field. Twenty acres was
owned by one family and the other 10 owned by another family.
The boxes actually are on the 10 acre parcel but right on the
property line. The habitat was Perfect until Monday. The 20
acre parcel was sold and a road is being constructed. Huge earth
moving equipment has disrupted the lives of the 4 little blues
inside the box. To the right of the box is 10 open and undisturbed
acres but to the left of the box about 25 feet away, there is
now a 20 foot tall hill of dirt that once was a grove of small
shrubs. The box is facing the wall of dirt. I had hoped the
blues would fledge into the small shrubs but they are gone now.
The dirt is directly in front of the box. It is amazing for
all the thunderous noise that they still seem to be ok and the
male is still feeding them in between the dirt runs. To
make matters worse, I fear that the female may have died. I
haven't seen her for quite some time. I've been leaving mealworms
for the male to feed the little ones 3-4 times a day. They will
be ready to fledge in a few days. My question is ... should
I move the box away from the hill of dirt and perhaps closer
to some shrubs about 40' away? If they fledge into the dirt,
will they be able to fly from there into the other nearby shrubs
and trees? With just the male to feed the 4 fledglings
under these conditions I don't hold out much hope that they
will make it after they leave the box, but only God knows. Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2002 22:46:21 -0700 Linda Violett - Yorba Linda, Calif. My recommendation would be to try moving the box. Bluebirds are amazing and will continue to nest under very adverse circumstances. For instance, several months ago I received a call from the city that they would be redoing the playground in a small neighborhood park. What they didn't say was that the whole park was being torn up. All the grass was removed, bulldozers reterracing new sidewalks, trenches for new sprinklers and a high fence around the entire construction zone. Bluebirds used both of those boxes during this upheaval, but the major construction is still ongoing and with no access (I'd stop by with binocs and see bluebirds regularly flying to the boxes). If I had an alternative (as you do), the boxes would have been moved. When active boxes are moved to a new tree on my hanging box trail, a handful of mealworms is offered to to see if the parents will still feed their chicks (they always have). From: "carol fitzpatrick" gdfitzmich"at"msn.com From: "BONNIE A. YEAGER" dement"at"frognet.net From: TomGaryH"at"aol.com Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 23:43:52 -0500 At 03:57 PM 7/28/02 -0400, BONNIE A. YEAGER wrote: ... Even if the nestbox is not directly facing a tree, the parents will call the fledglings to a tree nearby. I wouldn't mess with the nestbox at this stage. Kate Oschwald From: "Lawrence Herbert" lherbert"at"4state.com I'll always vote for leaving the nest site as is. If a person would like to move the box then do so after they have fledged. Good birding, Larry H., Joplin MO. From: hubertrap"at"webtv.net (Joe Huber) Hi Rebecca, I don't know if its legal to move a nest from one box to another at the same location, in your case replacing an old box. Maybe someone out there can tell us about this. We replace defective nests when needed whether it's legal or not. Removing or destroying a nest is illegal when it involves Bluebird's We likely do many things not quite legal when trying to help our Bluebirds. The best bet is to do only what you feel comfortable with. In the past I've read about experiments of moving nest box and pole with a active nest to see how far it can be moved before the birds abandon it. It's rare to have a need to move a bird's nest from one box to another. What way did you go? Best of luck. Joe Huber , Venice,Fl. Charter member NABS, Charter member OBS, Life member OBS Joe Huber hubertrap"at"webtv.net http://community.webtv.net/hubertrap/HOUSESPARROWCONTROL
http://community.webtv.net/hubertrap/RoostingBluebirds 27.1171494 N Lo -82.4124222 W Is it legal to move the nest to a new box? Rebecca J. -----Original Message----- Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 19:08:02 -0500 Haleya Priest Amherst MA However, if you move the nest to the new box without eggs or babies involved (ie they are in the middle of nest building or completed but have not laid their first egg) - you run the risk of having the parents abandon ship. They really don't have a 100% commitment to the nest or box until they've laid their first egg. So unless this box is REALLY falling apart, I would keep the
old box up and mount the new box next to the old box as Rhonda
suggests. That way you offer up several advantages you might
not have thought of! The online Bluebird Reference Guide: http://birds.cornell.edu/bluebirds/
From: rdb2006 "at"verizon.net [mailto:rdb2006 "at"verizon.net] Bluebirders, Saturday was a beautiful day here in MD and we had lots of visitors at our visitor center. I was talking with a fellow who told me that a vehicle had smashed into his wooden rail fence by the road where he had a nestbox this summer. The nestbox came down, but he was lucky because there were no birds nesting in it at the time. He asked me if you can relocate a nest with eggs or hatchlings to a new nestbox if you had to. I told him that I had never had to but that I imagine if the new nestbox isn't too far away (in the immediate vicinity), the parents would most likely not abandon the nest. Do you agree? Also, what if you had to place the nest in a new nestbox that was maybe 30-40 yards away? thanks!! --rudy in maryland |
BEST OF BLUEBIRD_L CLASSIFIEDS HOME | Audubon Society of Omaha | The Bluebird Box | Bluebird FAQs | Search | Contact meAll material was originally posted on the Bluebird_L or Bluebird mailing list, and has been reposted here with slight modifications to make the posts more readable in an HTML format. In cases in which quoted material has been deleted to save space, this is indicated by an ellipsis (...)For more information about Bluebird_L, check out http://www.cit.corn.edu/cit-pubs/email/using-lists/index.htm. If you wish to contact the author of a post, you will need to edit the e-mail address, replacing "at" with the "at" symbol (above the number 2 on your keyboard). (This change was made to discourage spammers.)If you are the author of a posting and would like to see a particular post (or posts) removed from these web pages, please contact me with the web page address, title of post, and date and time of the post(s), and I will remove whatever material you like. If you have a different opinion from one posted here, you need not contact me, as often I will have a different opinion too. The intent is to try and provide both sides to the issues facing bluebirders, and to do so in an impartial and objective manner.If you have problems, encounter broken links (unless they are within an e-mail thread, as I do not maintain those links), or have suggestions on how the site can be improved to make it more useful, please contact the Best of Bluebird-L Classifieds webmaster.Website design by
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