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Insects and Mites and Lice in the Nestbox (including use of insecticides inside nestboxes)Also see posts on Insecticides and Anting In addition to Messages that have appeared in the Bluebird Mailing Lists on this topic, the following are on the Audubon Society of Omaha website: Predators and Problems On The Bluebird Trail Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 12:10:35 -0500 Gary: I have had a lot of luck using bacillus thurengensis (SIC?) on tent caterpillars. Not harmful to anything but worms. ... ... Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 16:25:46 -0700 The tent caterpillars here are usually from the gypsy moth. Whenever one pops up, I immediately cut the branch off and burn the entire nest. They are causing great harm to the hardwoods in Michigan. I've seen them in cherry, peach, and oak. From what I've observed, it's not worth the damage to the trees, for the birds barely put a dent in their population. Nicholas ... Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 08:46:15 -0400 My understanding is that 'Tent Caterpillars' and 'Gypsy Moths' are NOT the same thing, as has been implied here. Gypsy Moths (Lymantria dispar), another European import, do not make 'tents'. The larvae spread out widely in the branches (hence 'Gypsy', and 'dispar', probably) and strip the leaves from entire trees and neighborhoods, finally pupating and hatching the moths on the tree-trunks. Tent Caterpillars, (genus: Malacosoma) often called Fall Webworms around here, spend their larval stage in those tight clusters we call 'tents', and don't move very far from them. Unfortunately for us humans, most birds do not care much for either of them. Cuckoos are an exception, and where we are the Cuckoos have a way of showing up whenever we have a severe Gypsy Moth infestation. (I have seen the entire outer walls of suburban houses completely covered with billions of the hairy larvae, who are searching vainly for leaves to eat.) In normal times we don't see the Cuckoos much. Bruce Burdett, NH Bluebird Conspiracy, Sunapee NH, where I've
seen no sign of Bluebird nesting yet, and no Tree Swallows.
Still pretty raw and wintry here, with a scattering of snow
yesterday, and about 5 days of intermittent (sp?) rain. ("Intermittant"
looks pretty awful.) Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 10:31:00 -0400 In answer to Nicholas' question: " Can I be too aggressive in burning and destroying Tent Caterpillar nests?", I'd say, simply, "No". But it seems to me that the task of burning and destroying A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER of them is pretty gargantuan, and maybe futile, like trying to kill all the ants, or all the mosquitoes. Maybe you could make a significant difference IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD, or IN YOUR YARD. Fortunately for us, these heavy infestations of TC and GM are subject to 'crashing'. One year in Connecticut, at the very height of the most severe Gypsy Moth infestations in decades, when there was hardly a leaf visible as far as one could see in any direction, every caterpillar simply died, overnight, apparently. They were all dead one morning, and there had been NO spraying. (-though some had been contemplated, of course.) I've read that they fall prey to some galloping contagion, perhaps a mite, or a virus. Some speculated that they had died of starvation, naturally, but even the ones which had found some isolated patch of remaining vegetation died where they stood, in the very act of munching a leaf. Interestingly, the completely stripped trees, oaks mostly where we were, put out an entire new 'suit' of full-sized leaves before the summer was over. But arborists said that this 'double-leafing' process leaves some trees so weakened that they die the following winter or spring. Bruce Burdett, NHBC blueburd"at"srnet.com
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 11:09:44 -0400 I was very worried about tent caterpillars when we had a strong infestation a couple of years ago, so I called the county agent. He told me not to worry about it, that although they did not particularly look good, they did not harm the trees seriously. Gypsy moths are another story, of course. Randy Jones ... Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 11:17:39 -0400 ... Dear Bruce, First of all, did the tent caterpillars AND gypsy moths die simultaneously?, or wouldn't you recall? After reading your description of how mysteriously the Gypsy Moths in your area died, I suspect they were sprayed with something. I believe they are commonly sprayed in many areas. I've been told that here in Georgia when they find a local infestation, they spray that area as well as a radius of so far around it. The financial impact is huge and to expedite things and to keep down the roar, they probably just went ahead and sprayed. It would cost less time and money to spray than to debate it. It wouldn't have to be done like low altitude crop spraying. You wouldn't even know it was done. Considering the billions of dollars in financial impact, can you even suspect that if the moths just up and died they wouldn't have performed sufficient scientific analysis to figure out if a mite or virus killed them? Or, do you think they would let a debate rage on while the trees died and thousands of millions of dollars were lost while they had a simple solution at their finger tips? I don't think so. I admit I'm guessing on this. But I also think they would cover up such a spraying even afterwards to prevent public outcry and the possible elimination of an effective solution when the next infestation occurs. I doubt anyone's complaining or investigating now that the moths are finally gone. If you are aware of what type of spray would be used, please write. Gary PS These Gypsy moths are such a huge problem, despite my strong feelings against the use of pesticides, I'm not even sure which side of the spraying debate I'd fall on. This MAY be one example when the risk of using the pesticide is outweighed by the ultimate outcome if nothing is done. We might be talking about the prevention of loss of all of our mature deciduous forests and many other species that depend on them, not just the loss of a few nesting cavities.
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 13:35:36 -0400 To: Gary Springer, et al, All I can say, relative to that mass die-off of Gypsy Moth caterpillars in Conn. back in the '80s, none of us in that area ever saw, heard, heard of, or smelled any evidence of spraying. If it was done, it must have been done with diabolical, indeed, superhuman secrecy and stealth. There was talk about the possibility, of course, and lots of debate about the pros and cons. There were some small, scattered, isolated, well-publicized spray-hits here and there around the state, but the public sentiment against spraying in our area was so strong that I really don't believe it ever happened. Our area was predominantly residential, and people were concerned chiefly about the family health hazards involved with spraying. As I said, I READ, back then, about the mite/virus theory, but I certainly don't have any hard information about it. I wonder if any Listers do. And in response to another Lister's query: No. The Tent Caterpillar/Webworm population was not affected by this die-off. Only the Gypsy Moth caterpillars bought the farm. Bruce Burdett, NHBC Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 14:39:38 -0500 There are two naturally occuring pathogens which are affecting some control on the Gypsy Moth. The first naturally occuring pathogen is the viral disease Nucleopolyhedrosis. However, the one which seems to hold the most promise is the Entomophthoralean Fungus. This is a host specific fungus which attacks the Gypsy Moth. Originally released in the early 1900's in North America, E. maimaiga was first thought a failure. In 1989 E. maimaiga was found to be creating vast epizootics in several New England states. In 1992 this fungus had now been spread throughout the entire Gypsy Moth's range. Since that time, scientists are studying these epizootics to determine how E. maimaiga will effect the long term population dynamics of the Gypsy Moth. The fungus was brought from Japan if I recall correctly. Fread J. Loane Date: Fri, 07 Apr 2000 19:25:15 -0400 Gary, Here in PA, we have intermittent attacks of both Webworm and Gypsy moth. If memory serves, Webworm is in spring and Gypsy moth later. Both construct nest that appear web like. They have sprayed here twice in twenty years and it really does work. They use BT, don't remember the full name, but it does not harm anything but caterpillars - most any type. I bought some at my local farm supply store for use on my own trees. Here it seems the hit all the cherry trees first, both wild and tame. Next is any other fruit tree, then anything that's left. Lynn near Reading Pa ... Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 19:04:00 -0400 Dear Fread, In your opinion, do the pathogens you described work in such a manner that they could be ineffective as the Gypsy Moth population exploded, then , suddenly kill all the larvae of the Gypsy Moth in the narrow time frame that has been described as "over night" in such a wide and heavily infested area? Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: Fread Loane ... Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 19:53:41 -0500 Both viral and fungal infection are natural occurences in the Gypsy Moth population. Infection generally is transfered when the caterpillar eats foliage contaminated with either fungal spores or viral occlusion bodies. The viral pathogen invades through the gut wall, reproducing rapidly in the internal tissues causing organ failure. Eventually the host caterpillar will rupture distributing viral occlusion bodies into the environment which serve to infect other Gypsy Moth caterpillars. Both viral and fungal pathogens can remain at low, inactive levels and cause little mortality in low density populations of Gypsy Moths. When Gypsy Moth populations increase to a certain level, massive reproduction of the viral agent occurs resulting in very high levels of mortality (an epizootic). This is the most common cause of sudden collapse of high density Gypsy Moth populations. Such a collapse could appear to have occured overnight, however, it had been building for a number of weeks. Fread J. Loane Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 08:36:41 -0400 Does anyone on the list know how to get rid of Japanese Beetles on my flowers and cactus and yet not be harmful to all of my birds? The cactus is in a rock garden around the bluebird house and I've got 8 day old babies in there. I've been told Diazinon is harmful to the birds. Thanks! Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 08:47:53 -0700 There has been some talk out here about soaking tobacco and spraying the plants with the juice. I am planning to try it but haven't yet. My egg plant vines are looking like someone used them to punch out confetti, but all five of my baby blues fledged. Nicholas p.s. How do you get cactus to grow in Michigan? Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 09:17:45 EDT There is a product called BioNeem. It is organic, and expensive. It's supposed to be safe. I used it for two or three years. However, this year I had so many grubs that my lawn was almost destroyed. You could pull the grass up with your hands like a carpet. I ended up having to use grub control, which is toxic, on my lawn. Fortunately, they applied the stuff and within an hour we had a day of rain which washed the chemical into the lawn. They also did not apply it near my bluebird houses...But who knows? The lawn man I use told me NEVER to use the Japanese Beetle traps. He said that only brought more and more beetles to your property. Hope this is helpful. Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 09:42:17 -0400 I too have heard the tobacco juice idea, but nicotine is poisonous. Our birds feed on insects on poisoned plants, especially when babies are still young and need soft insects to eat. I would NEVER forgive myself if I deliberately poisoned the birds in my boxes. Handing-picking is the only safe method of control. It's semi-disgusting, but quick and easy (beetles don't bite or sting), and most of all it's safe for birds. I pick them into a little jar of soapy water (soap keeps them from crawling out and escaping) and am careful not to be near the nestbox for more than 10 mins. at a time, as I don't want to prevent parents from bringing in food. Midmorning is the best time, when sun is on the plants and beetles are actively mating. If you wait till afternoon, female beetles will have already laid their eggs in your lawn. Dot "Nicholas A. Zbiciak" wrote: Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 09:54:36 -0400 Barb et all, Rodale always used to say that the most natural way to get
rid of pests like beetles is to gather up a bunch, blend them
in a blender with enough water to make a nice spray, and spray
your garden with it. They are supposed to leave any place that
has their own dead on it. Should be easy to check out Karen :-) Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 10:09:04 -0400 Nine years ago, I put down milky spore powder in a pattern as prescribed, making a grid of 3-foot squares over my entire property and that of my neighbor. We see an occasional Japanese beetle now, but hardly any. The milky spores when they get wet, become a "disease" which infects any grub of the Japanese beetle (and some others, I believe), so that they, too, become "disease" factories. The spore disease gradually spreads from the 3-foot grid until the entire area is "infected" and killing any grubs which hatch out on your property. Of course, they will fly in from nearby and lay their eggs, but they are killed before they do any damage. I am not a biologist, but I believe the disease is harmful
only to the grubs in the ground, which do not emerge and therefore
do not become food for After nine years, we still have the problem under control, and I have read that the milky spores remain active in the soil for 20 years or more. You can probably get the powder at a garden store. It is expensive,
though. I think I paid $100 for 10 pounds nearly ten years ago,
but it was worth it. Randy Jones ... Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 16:07:33 -0500 There have been several posts about safe and effective control of various grubs (larval stages of beetles). The use of insecticides to control these insects often will cause dying grubs to come to the surface where they can be ingested by birds. There are other methods and alternative treatments to control these insects which does not cause harm to the environment. Below are three URLs listed which offer alternative treatments: Essentially what you would be doing using either of these treatments would be to innoculate your soil with either nematodes (tiny microscopic worms which are host-specific to beetle larvae) or using a baccillus (in this case Baccillus popillae, which is also host-specific to beetle larvae). Oftentimes, because of re-infestation from 360 degrees around you, these treatments can be a one-time treatment. In both cases, both the baccillus and the nematode must have access to grubs to keep their populations built up in the soil to remain effective. I have personally used Baccillus popillae to control several forms of Chafer Beetles and found it to be still effective after seven years from the first treatment of my garden and lawns. Because you are dealing with live organisms, you must follow the manufacturer's directions to properly innoculate your soil. Do not expect instant control! The nematodes and baccillus have to build their populations in your soil to become effective. I hope this will offer a different choice to those who wish not to use insecticides. Fread J. Loane Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 19:15:57 -0400 The Organic Gardening magazine, many years ago, had this solution about blending bugs to keep like bugs out of gardens, etc. I never tried it becaus my wife would not let me use the blender! If this works, it might be a revolutionary way to control House
Sparrows. Please let us know. Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 08:29:52 -0400 I like your wife - will not try the blender effect - thank you all for your suggestions! Didn't see too many of them on my flowers yesterday, but will look over the the suggestions and decide from there. Thanks! Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 15:02:15 -0700 (PDT) I recently opened a nest box to find a dead ten day old bluebird nestling covered with beetle-like insects. They were about the size of a half of a dime, black with a yellow spot on the back of the head and shoulder area with a black area in the middle of the yellow spot. They are obviously attracted to decaying matter. Does anyone know what this insect is?? Dan Sparks Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 19:31:47 -0400 To Dan and all, The beetles you found on the dead nestling are carrion beetles. Sometimes also called burying beetles. They are a part of nature's clean-up crew, similar to the vultures. They had nothing to do with the demise of the nestling but are there to clear away the dead which will be recycled to their own young. Nature is not always beautiful but is always truly fascinating! Ruth Edwards. Westport, MA Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 20:42:52 -0500 Dan Sparks et al The beetle which you aptly described is the American Carrion Beetle (Necrophila americana). This particular carrion beetle is used in forensic entomology to help determine the likely time of death, as it metamorphoses through a distinct set of growth patterns. The beetle was an "after the act" benneficial only
recycling the dead bird. I have attached a URL to show two of
the most common forms of this beetle: Fread J. Loane Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2000 20:19:10
-0600 Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2000 22:05:51 -0500 From: "BONNIE A. YEAGER" dement"at"frognet.net Has anyone in Ohio observed bluebirds eating a rather large (~1 inch) white larvae in the spring of the year? These larvae are much bigger than a Japanese beetle larvae. The bluebirds typically beat the larvae to death on the top of fence post prior to eating them. I am sure these larvae are Very high in fat content and are a Great food source for getting the birds into top form for the breeding season. I have observed bluebirds eating these larvae for several years and would like to know what the adult form (beetle) of this larvae is. Can anyone help? Thank you, Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 21:15:25 -0600 I'm in Wisconsin but I'll bet those big grubs are brown June bugs/beetles. I dig up plenty every year and toss 'em to the robins. There's a neat article with perfect descriptions of both grub and bug at http://newton.dep.anl.gov/natbltn/100-199/nb121.htm from the archives (1947) of the Cook County Forest Preserve (Illinois, my home state and county!). ---- From: "Fread J" firefrost2"at"hotmail.com Fread Loane, Tulsa, OK The beetle larvae which was being softened by pounding against a wooden post by a bluebird was possibly the larval form of the Masked Chafer beetle, more commonly known as "the June Bug". The adult form is generally between one-quarter to one-half inch in length, is reddish-brown in color, has a hard shell (carapace) and is quite rotund (nice way of saying he is "fat"). They commonly gather at a yard/porch light on a late Spring evening (hence the common name "June Bug"). The larval form is a thick, curled white grub known for its capacity to turn turf grasses brown when they munch away at the roots. While most nursery staff will steer you to some of the broad spectrum insecticides that kill indiscriminately, I would rather see your approach to remove these larval beetle forms from your turf areas by using beneficial nematodes. These are microscopic tiny worms which attack larval forms found in the soil. Once your soil is inoculated properly, the nematode population will stabilize and should provide satisfactory control for years to come. 'Fisher people' on this list will recall finding these grubs under hay or manure piles where they were collected and used as an excellent tough bait for Channel Catfish! The biological-biorational control that I would recommend is not commercially available at present. Essentially it is a new found strain of "milky spore disease" caused by entomophathogenic nematodes, the natural enemy of white grubs. Watch for new press releases on this product (Yet to be named). The beneficial entomophathogenic nematode that I would strongly recommend is Heterohabditis 'bacteriophora' as it has consistently shown good activity against white grubs. It is found in the commercially available product of "CRUISER". A second biological-biorational control that is available is the synthesized hormone "ecdysone". This hormone controls the molting cycles of white grubs. Using this synthetic hormone triggers the untimely response of molting and results in death of the grub. Look for the product name of "MACH 2" (halofenozide) as it has shown consistent and excellent control over a number of white grub species. Fread J. Loane, horticulturist From: Michelle Martin [mailto:shell7"at"cox.net] From: MJShearer Hi Michelle, That looks more like pinfeathers than mites on your nestling, so I wouldn't try to remove them. You wouldn't want to pluck the poor baby! :-) I'd also wait until the babies are a little older to remove the egg. MJ Mary Jane Shearer; Tucker, GA From: Evelyn Cooper Into my seventh year of monitoring my bluebird trail, I have never had a mite problem. Aren't mites more blackish looking and VERY tiny? Evelyn Cooper, Delhi,LA From: Michelle Martin Thanks Ann, for taking a look. I do know what the nestlings look like, but those small brown things throw me. I just don't remember seeing that before now. Guess I jumped the gun, but I'm glad it's not. I'm not talking about the black things protruding from the skin, I know that is feathers. I meant the brown, right in the center of the pic. Maybe I should have drawn an arrow to them. Thank you again ! Michelle Martin Central Louisiana From: jwick"at"tds.net Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 6:30 PM Subject: Re: mites on nestling Hi Michelle! Your nestling bluebirds look totally normal to me. Are you seeing something moving on the birds? Have you seen bluebird nestlings before? Normally birds have feather mites, although I've never seen any on bluebirds and I've banded more than 4,000 in the past 6 nesting seasons and young nestlings are featherless. The little points I could observe from your photos were the locations where the feathers will eventually emerge from beneath the skin. I hope this helps.......... Ann Wick Black Earth, WI From: Michelle Martin Thanks Ann, for taking a look. I do know what the nestlings look like, but those small brown things throw me. I just don't remember seeing that before now. Guess I jumped the gun, but I'm glad it's not. I'm not talking about the black things protruding from the skin, I know that is feathers. I meant the brown, right in the center of the pic. Maybe I should have drawn an arrow to them. Thank you again ! Michelle Martin Central Louisiana From: Brucemac1"at"aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 8:21 PM Subject: Re: mites on nestling Hello Michelle et al, I think that it's a little early in the nesting season for mites. I may be mistaken, tho. When we become concerned about mites and/or blowfly larvae, we'll place a handful of cedar shavings, or pine needles underneath the nest(s). Lift the nests carefully and place the needles or shavings under it. Replace it and that should help. I've heard others mention that they don't like to use cedar shavings, but I've had good luck with them. I keep my boxes well supplied with cedar shavings as soon as the nesting season is over and thru the winter. Keeps 'em clean, fresh and insect free...!! Bruce Macdonald, SW Ontario From: [ mailto:Rappaho"at"aol.com ] Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 9:10 PM Subject: Re: cedar shavings In a Message dated 4/4/04 7:22:43 PM, Brucemac1"at"aol.com writes: I've heard others mention that they don't like to use cedar shavings For those afraid of the cedar sudt and it harming the lungs of the birds, you can purchase cedar oil. This is usually used to refresh those cedar eggs or other cedar products. You could probably thin with linseed oil or other light non gumming oil and brush on. It is very pungent. kathy From: JOHN & BARBARA SIBIO [mailto:jsibio"at"comcast.net ] Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 9:53 PM Subject: mites on nestling I've been very fortunate over the years; have never had an insect problem. Years ago, someone, and I don't remember who (it's been that long!) suggested using diatomaceous earth to prevent infestations. Has anyone tried this? I was told to clean out the box at the end of the nesting season, and dust it very lightly with diatomaceous earth. To brush some in the cracks and seams so that any bugs hiding there would come in contact with it. I know nothing about it and any effects it might have on the birds, etc. Seems like it would be OK under the nest, but I don't know how effective this stuff is. Anyone with experience??? Barbara in Cloverdale, CA From: [mailto:Rappaho"at"aol.com] Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 10:05 PM Subject: Re: diatomaceous earth In a Message dated 4/4/04 9:00:31 PM, jsibio"at"comcast.net writes: dust it very lightly with diatomaceous earth This is a fossilize teeney weeney critter.... powder fine. It will not harm birds or people. It is edible, though I have no idea why one would want to do that. It does kill pantry bugs though. I do not know if it will kill the mites. Are they hard shelled like fleas and such? If so, then yes. The thing with diatomaceous earth is that if it gets damp.. it is worthless. Think mud. kathy. From: Rappaho"at"aol.com From: Paula [ mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com ] Michelle, Strange that you are only seeing this on one nestling? Others may have different/better advice, but I would not try to pick them off. I would think you would do more damage to bird trying to remove them than the mites are doing and the nest would be absolutely infested with mites also so removing a few would not make much difference I imagine. My Tree Swallow nests are often absolutely swarming with mites when I remove the nests. They crawl by the millions up my arms and sometimes even further. It is "mitey" disgusting, I can tell you. The bird mites don't bother people, and they won't kill their host usually. Most of my TRES fledge fine - even with all those mites. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio From: Paula [ mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com ] Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 1:40 AM Subject: Re: Mites on Nestling Evelyn, The bird mites in my TRES nests are red and VERY tiny and VERY fast. Paula Z, Powell (Central) Ohio From: Michelle Martin [mailto:shell7"at"cox.net] Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 8:36 AM Subject: Re: Mites on Nestling Well Paula, if that is the way mites are in behavior, then I bet that's not what it is. There is nothing on the other birds, or under the nest, pole and so forth. Thanks for the advice and info ! Michelle Martin Central Louisiana From: Bruce Burdett [mailto:blueburd"at"tds.net] John & Barbara, Personally, I prefer to clean out my boxes NOT at the end of the season, as you mentioned, but right after every fledging. Usually, by fledging time, my nests are too infested, filthy and beaten down for any self-respecting Bluebird to build on. Bruce Burdett SW NH From: Kenny
Kleinpeter Diatomaceous Earth (or DE) is not as recommended by responsible bird organizations as it used to be. This powdery substance, the ground-up skeletons of tiny marine animals, has very sharp edges that lacerate the insects, killing them. It was realized that the “almighty EPA” states that if inhaled, DE can cause inflammation of the lungs and irritate the eyes on contact – this is for humans, so a reasonable thinking person could assume the effects would be far worse on a tiny, vulnerable nestling. So, if one does use it, it should be placed under the nest or however it is least likely to become airborne and no more that a teaspoon would be necessary. Furthermore, DE is rendered ineffective when wet (I think it combines). Like you, Evelyn, I have never seen an unreasonable number of nest mites that would warrant chemical intervention. I would think that a prudent blue birder would simply do a nest replacement if it appeared that mites were infesting a nest. Simply place the nestlings in a covered container (like a cigar box), remove and properly discard the nest (away from the site), take a handful of pine needles (or pine straw for you Yankees) and fashion into a bowl. Oh yes, and don't forget to return the nestlings. Kenny Kleinpeter. Baton Rouge, LA From: Don McCartney
[mailto:donmc59"at"earthlink.net] Yes, I've heard the arguments of some list members knocking cedar boxes and cedar shavings. However, until I see the slightest bit of negative evidence in my boxes, I am going to disagree with this. I line my kestrel boxes with two inches of cedar shavings, and have been doing so for years. Last year, I fledged 135 kestrels, of which 120 were banded. Since the AMKE's bring in NO nest material, the nestlings and incubating adults are directly exposed to the cedar shavings. When the nestboxes are cleaned out, the box remains, complete with bones, insect parts and shavings are sent to a graduate student at the University of Chicago for analysis of the kestrels' diet in various habitats. Out of all the nestings, I have NEVER seen the slightest deleterious effect of the cedar shavings. I use cedar for two reasons: one is that the cedar shavings available in this area are of a larger size than pine shavings, and thus don't blow out of the boxes (well-ventilated with 3" entrance holes) in windy areas like the smaller pine shavings tend to do. Kestrels incubating eggs on a bare wood floor are a recipe for disaster. The second is the control of pests in the boxes. I consulted with a professional avian toxicologist who gave me his unhedged recommendation that I use cedar shavings to derive the possible benefit of control of nestbox parasites that may be present. This seems to be a hot-button topic with some list members, but that is my consistently positive experience for the past eight years. Of course, I don't use shavings for bluebird, TRES or ash-throat boxes. There are some published recommendations for lining box bottoms with shavings for chickadees and white-breasted nuthatches, but they seem to utilize boxes with and without shavings with equal frequency. In most cases, shavings are a necessity for inducing northern flickers to nest and we are in the early stages of experimentation with various box-levels of shavings for Lewis's woodpeckers. Don McCartney Bend, in the high desert of central Oregon TBN and NABS member From: judymellin
[mailto:judymellin"at"netzero.net] So, here we go with regional differences again! At the end of a hatching/fledging in my area, the tree swallows leave a filthy nest but the ones from the bluebirds look as if they have never been used! The inside if the tree swallow box is splattered with feces but the bluebirds seem able to carry away all the fecal sacs- I wish my house were as clean! I do remove used nests after the young have fledged, if I get to the boxes before another nesting is started. At the end of the season, though, I scrub out all the boxes that were used with a bleach,dishwashing soap and water solution. I have never seen a blowfly or mite and I firmly believe it is a result of cleaning the boxes every fall. Now I know there are those who feel that there is some type of wasp that has a positive effect on blowflies (well, maybe not positive for the blowflies!) but, since I apparently don't have the problem, I apparently don't have the wasp! I am a firm believer in live and let live so all I do, once a week, is open the box, look inside, close the box quickly and walk away to make my notes. It might be good to remember that birds nesting in natural cavities make it on their own. I treat the birds that choose boxes on our trail the same way. I can say that, since I began monitoring this trail in 1993, the only young that have been lost were usually over Memorial Day when it got either very hot or very cold. I did find one perfect adult male dead in a box with nesting materials clutched in a foot. Not bad for all these years! Judy Mellin NE IL. From: "Bruce
Burdett" John & Barbara, Personally, I prefer to clean out my boxes NOT at the end of the season, as you mentioned, but right after every fledging. Usually,by fledging time, my nests are too infested, filthy and beaten down for any self-respecting Bluebird to build on. Bruce Burdett SW NH From: MJShearer [mailto:eshearer"at"comcast.net]
Hi Judy, Bruce, and all.... You're lucky if you've never had a mite infested nestbox! Maybe it is a regional problem, but I clean my boxes between nestings with a mild Clorox solution, and my most of my boxes still have some mites -- some more than others. Believe me, when you have a mite infested nest box, you'll know it! They'll be crawling all over the box -- inside and out. The adults keep the nestbox clean until the day of fledging, then they abandon their housekeeping duties, perhaps to encourage the nestlings to fledge. Bluebirds don't seem to have as many as some other species, but feather mites are a real problem for the Cardinals around here. Sometimes they loose all the feathers on their heads. Maybe they're not able to groom their heads as well as the rest of their bodies, but it's strange and a little sad to see those beautiful birds without their crests and head feathers. MJ (Mary Jane Shearer; Tucker, GA) From: JOHN & BARBARA
SIBIO [mailto:jsibio"at"comcast.net] From: Kenny Kleinpeter
[mailto:kpkmajk"at"cox.net] Parasitic insects don't "over-winter" in nestboxes because they can't survive more than a week without a host. We should be very sure why we are using things like Clorox (tm), a very strong chemical combination of sodium hypochlorite and sodium hydroxide. We shouldn't confuse our personal, human perceptions of what constitutes "clean" with the reasonably assumed negative impact to an entirely different and much more vulnerable creature the likes of a tiny, just-hatched nestling. Certainly no more than a 10% bleach solution in water should be used. Most detergent labels will tell you never to mix them with bleach, so please be careful. I wish we would err on the side of caution and never introduce chemicals anywhere around these little birds that we attract. They have enough problems trying to survive off insects that we spend billions of dollars a year poisoning! On behalf of bluebirds, please allow me to take exception to the notion that "birds nesting in natural cavities make it on their own." Such a statement is an affront to the courageous and dedicated people like Thomas Musselman and William Duncan who, during the last century worked so hard for the bluebird recovery efforts. In 1950, most people in America had never seen a bluebird. If there were any "natural cavities" left, they were taken by starlings or sparrows. There is no documentation as to the success rate of bluebirds nesting in natural cavities. A hundred and fifty years ago, I dare say, the predation rates for bluebirds in natural cavities were extremely high. Only the sheer number of these birds countered the risks they took in such an environment. Those numbers of bluebirds were supported by a much greater volume and variety of insects then we have today. So, it would probably be more accurate to say "bluebirds only made it on their own before humans arrived." I dare say that we are the bluebird's worst predator. We preyed on the bluebird's natural cavities by clear-cutting and introducing non-native, invasive species until they were nearly extinct. Now, we must intervene again, but this time, to save them. This must involve more than the casual checking of nestboxes; this bluebirding is a full-time job. We must closely inspect the bluebird's territory for competitors and predators. We must closely inspect nests for signs parasites. Problems like blowfly infestations are difficult to detect. In fact, most of them take their blood meal in the evening and drop back down into the safety of the nest during the day's activities. We must carefully but regularly inspect eggs and hatchlings until they fledge. Finally, we should remove the nest for the next attempt. Only through these informed, careful inspections and documentations will we learn to improve the bluebird's chance for survival. As many of us as possible must become obsessed with these birds in order to learn as much as possible about their needs in an ever-changing environment due to our ever-increasing human impact. Kenny Kleinpeter Baton Rouge, LA From: Bruce
Burdett [mailto:blueburd"at"tds.net] From: Haleya
Priest [mailto:mablue"at"gis.net] I would also add from my own experience that I don't think clorox bleach after nesting is going to solve the mite problem. From what I see, the birds bring them in when they come to nest OR when an infested bird perches on a box. So I think as Kenny is suggesting, mites don't over winter, but are brought back by migrating birds - where they over wintered on the birds in warmer weather that didn't kill the mites. :-) H From: PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com Just an afterthought on mite discussion. I posted this last year, but will again for those that did not see it. My trail is adjacent to a house that has chickens and pigeons. Although I don't see mites in the EABL nests, the TRES nests generally are swarming with them. As I said, it is "mitey" disgusting. I deduced that many of the feathers the birds bring in to line their nests could be infested with mites from chickens or pigeons so last spring I gave them clean feathers to line their nests with. I did notice less mites on the nests after fledging. As I write this, my scalp is tingling because the first time I removed TRES nest, I felt mites on my arms and head before I saw them. They are amazingly tiny and even more amazingly fast for their size. As Haleya said, there are a gazillion of them, but birds still fledge fine for most part. I have never attributed a loss to mites to my knowledge. After I remove nest, remaining mites soon leave too as there is nothing for them to eat. So I would recommend tossing some clean feathers near the TRES nestbox during nest building. If you time it right, they swoop and catch them in midair and take them into the box - quite a sight and fun for children of all ages. Paula Z Powell (Central ) Ohio From:
Burnham, Barbara [mailto:Barbara.Burnham"at"zzz.zzz] The purple martin web site http://www.purplemartin.org/ has an excellent section on nest parasites, with drawings, pics and lots of info. Barbara Burnham, Ellicott City , MD From: Brucemac1"at"aol.com [mailto:Brucemac1"at"aol.com] Hello Again Keith..... From: Chuck Jensen [mailto:cjensen"at"dts9000.com] Purple Martin nest monitors sprinkle a little Severn powder in the nesting material when mites are present…but not on the nestlings. Works like a champ. Hold on now…don’t bother lighting those flame throwers. Better that the nestlings have an infinitesimal chance of harm from the Severn than certain death from the lice/mites. From: Robert Richerson [mailto:roblrich"at"alltel.net] Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 6:42 PM Subject: Re: Lice You are correct Chuck, Sevin is the way to go. Sevin works wonders on lice, mites, and even Blowfly Larvae if treated at an early stage. Years ago PM landlords went away from Sevin and to Diatomaceous Earth, then only recommending nest replacements, and the cycle is back to Sevin. From: rob barron [mailto:rebel1956"at"comcast.net] Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 8:36 PM Subject: RE: Lice OK, no flame throwers, but I’m a wildlife biologist and licensed pesticide applicator, and here’s some food for thought. Although similar, mites and lice are two different arthropods. Lice are usually species specific and usually feed on the protective sheath of growing feathers. They don’t suck blood but can feed on irritated skin. Secondary infections are usually the cause of mortality from these lousy ectoparasites. Mites, on the other hand, do suck blood and can cause anemia or even death in birds. Sevin (Carbaryl) is an organophosphate currently under review by the EPA. It is a cholinesterase inhibitor that acts on the acetylcholine in the central nervous system and red blood cells. The EPA’s 2005 statement on Carbaryl says it is probably more toxic to small passerine birds, highly toxic to honey bees, restricted in use in many areas with threatened and endangered species, toxic to fish and amphibians, need I go on? Yes, you might still be able to find it at Walmart, but Sevin is nothing to take lightly. I would treat the empty nest box first and then use a Pyrethrum based insecticide before using Sevin as a last resort. Bluebirds are important to us, but they are just one link level in an interrelated food chain, all of which must stay intact or it all starts to fall apart. You’re probably all too young to remember Rachel Carson’s Silent Spring, but pesticides have done nothing but harm to wildlife. Preventing the loss of several fledglings on a trail must be balanced with the ecological consequences caused by our well intentioned actions. Bluebirds have evolved naturally with ectoparasites without our intervention. Are we helping the gene pool of a species that can’t survive without our intervention at every step of the egg laying, incubation, and rearing process? It’s something to ponder. Here’s an interesting link for more opinions on the use of organophosphates. Thanks, From: Robert Richerson [mailto:roblrich"at"alltel.net] It is nice to keep this a "flame free" emailing list. With that said I do have some opinions and I will state them strongly and hopefully clearly. And to post a disclaimer, I am also a Purple Martin landlord. By default, most PM landlords are also BB and Tree Swallow landlords. I am the first to recognize that there is a difference in numbers in regards to these birds and the burden on their respective landlords. BB nests are much easier to give special care to than it is to a very large PM colony. Please keep that in mind when reading the rest of this email. From: rob barron [mailto:rebel1956"at"comcast.net] Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 10:16 PM Subject: RE: Lice Hi Rob, ... Thanks for your well researched and well thought out response. I’m building a purple martin house now and if I’m fortunate enough to get any to occupy it I’ll defer to your expertise. I can Google “EPA” and “Sevin” and get a thousand hits of contradictory information from as far back as 1993, so I don’t have any more faith in the EPA data on pesticides affecting wildlife than I do them protecting our water supply from mercury or perflourootanoic acid, but in the case of purple martins I agree with the judicious use of organophosphates by people knowledgeable in using them. I don’t think any data on organophosphate health effects on humans applies to songbirds, with their shorter life span and more rapid development, higher metabolisms, rapid digestion, diets of insects gleaned from our chemically over-treated lawns, etc. We are responsible for their lack of a place to nest, we didn’t introduce ectoparasites. In the case of a threatened or endangered species, more drastic measures are definitely warranted. Anyone can find EPA statistics to support whichever side they are on. I’m not taking sides, but think we have to think about all species before getting out the pump sprayer. I agree with most of your arguments about our responsibility to cavity nesters because of our past environmental sins (and respect all your points), but I think we have a lot more to learn and that the indiscriminate pesticide use in apple orchards (an introduced species which probably for a time increased bluebird abundance to an all-time high) might have had as much to do with bluebird problems as the lack of cavity nests. It wasn’t studied enough as it was happening and none of us really know for sure; we all just have our hypotheses and theories. From: Chuck Jensen [mailto:cjensen"at"dts9000.com] Rob, From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net] Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 9:02 AM Subject: Re: Lice Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas a warm 45*F already From: rob barron [mailto:rebel1956"at"comcast.net] Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 3:46 PM Subject: RE: Lice ... I can’t argue with your well reasoned approach. I have read a lot about pesticides being metabolized more quickly by growing birds and my point was that even if the EPA says Sevin in safe for humans, the amount a baby bird might ingest might be a much larger dose. I don’t like the availability of potentially toxic chemicals to the general public, almost always with little or no instruction about how and when to safely use them. In grew up working on farms where Sevin, Timic, and I don’t remember what else were indiscriminately used by untrained farm workers (my brothers and I included). It ran off into my favorite fishing pond and got in our well. We used to fill sprayer tanks with a mix of fertilizers and insecticides and reach in up to our armpits to stir it up while filling the tanks with water. My twin brother died of leukemia at 30, my older brother was diagnosed at 49, my father at 70. Numerous other farm boys in a 10 square mile radius had mysterious medical issues from blindness to sudden paralysis. Maybe it’s all coincidence. With that said, I’ll defer to your expertise and stop beating this dead horse. Thanks again, From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net] Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2006 8:12 AM Subject: using insecticides inside nestboxes Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas 5% Sevin at one time was made/registered for treating lice and mites on poultry and also fleas and ticks on dogs. It is not registered for these uses anymore. Nicotine Sulphate has been removed from the market. There are various Permethrin or Pyrethroids on the market that are registered for use on animals. Purple Martins remain in a communal house for months and pests spread from compartment to compartment. Bluebirds and Tree Swallows are in the boxes for less time and often switch to a clean box for a second nesting or we could easily use a dip for the entire nestbox or use a spray bottle and kill mites/lice in nooks and crannies in the empty nestbox with a chlorine bleach solution or soapy water that I assume would have few lingering effects between nesting attempts by the birds. The adult birds will always have some sort of parasite on them and they control these with bathing in water, taking dust baths, "anting" and spreading their feathers to allow sunlight to drive the pests off of their bodies. Young birds in a nestbox cannot remove parasites that build up populations in a few nestboxes as the season progresses but upon leaving the nestboxes they should be able to remove most of these pests. The average bluebirder will seldom find any pests that will affect a majority of their nestboxes so you should not bother treating or worrying about every nestbox every nesting attempt. You should look into every nestbox several times every nesting attempt and I like a side opening or front opening box so that I can easily check the nesting material top to bottom without touching it. Look at every old nest you remove especially if you have a trail and have lost some young birds in other boxes. Blowflies can be a problem some years in some locations. Ants of several different species may want to use your nestboxes, Fire Ants may kill some young birds. Wasps probably will use some of your nestboxes and I prefer to use a putty knife to remove the nests and not kill the queens early in the season but to drive them to another location. The only insecticide you should use in bluebird type nestboxes would be one of the pump spray mite/lice sprays made for canaries or parakeets. Follow the directions (one little spritz of spray in a small box will NUKE any insects, don't soak the wood) and only use in an empty nestbox after the young have flown or remove the eggs or baby birds and usually the nest before spraying a MAJOR infestation. If you only see a couple of mites or lice I would not treat with chemicals inside the nestbox. Any chemical or oil or even soap that gets on a bird egg will be absorbed through the calcium in the shell and possibly on into the blood stream of the developing bird. Purple Martins, pigeons, starlings and House Sparrows are often communal nesting and roosting/feeding together and they share mites and lice and diseases among each other more than say bluebirds, chickadees and titmice ETC. Use common sense first to see if you need to use a chemical as the last choice. KK From: Dottie, Hickory Hollow, Brown County, Indiana [mailto:yumyumkatts"at"voyager.net] Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2006 11:31 AM Subject: Re: using insecticides inside nestboxes The Purple Martin people in the Central Indiana Purple Martin Asso., a club formed for Purple Martin people in central Indiana a few years ago, use Most of the Purple Martin people also do nest changes regularly--several I haven't had to do nest changes, unfortunately, as I've only had one Martin pair to nest last year and have babies after four long years of However, two bachelor Martins, who wanted to mate with the female, killed the Martin babies. Looking forward to this year and better success. Martins start coming Dottie, Hickory Hollow From: Mary Clare [mailto:maryclare"at"cox.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:22 AM Subject: Western Bluebird spreading wings on ground I recently observed 2 Western Bluebirds ( M & F ) land on the ground and put their heads down, spread their wings and lay there in the sun for about 1 minute in our front yard. Is there any significance to this behavior? The temperature was about 75-80F on a clear dry southern calif day. We have 6-7 Western Bluebirds that we see on a regular basis at our mealworm feeder. They have nested here for 2 years. Thanks- From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 8:20 AM Subject: Re: Western Bluebird spreading wings on ground Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas I would watch this pair to see if they repeat this over the next several weeks. They will sometimes do this while sitting on a tree branch. Check their old nest after the first young fledge by shaking the nest over a colored sheet of paper. Mites and lice are nearly clear and have little body pigment to protect them from UV rays of the sun. When they drink blood it shows up in their digestive tract first as bright red and later as dark brown. Often as soon as the birds finish sunbathing you will see them preening their belly feathers and wing feathers with their bills. They are now sweeping or combing the mites or lice off their feathers. Mites and lice are tiny creatures that will hide in the cracks of wood nestboxes. Or they will hide in the dust in the bottom of the boxes or old nesting material. I have seen ants collecting pollen from flowers and I will assume that sometimes when we find ants in nestboxes they may actually be only hunting old insect parts or very possibly they will capture and eat mites and lice when they encounter them or their eggs. Ants are scavengers on the most part except for the several imported fire ant species. From: Fred Vroom [mailto:fqvroom"at"comcast.net] Questions for the Bluebird List, Also, considering that insects can be a major problem the adults and fledglings, it seems logical to me to use some insecticide to make their lives more pleasant. I am considering using pyrethrines 0.02% and Peperonyl Butoxide 0.2% to put under nesting material. If you do not recommend an insecticide, what is the proof it causes a health problem? Thanks, From: Bruce Burdett [mailto:blueburd"at"verizon.net] Fred V., From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net] Shavings: Thin wood shavings can get wet and hold moisture, sphagnum moss is used in plant soils to HOLD water. You can test the insecticidal properties of "cedar shavings" by taking a few mealworms and placing them in a mixture of the shavings and their food and see if they die. Would someone who has these test to see if cedar shavings will kill the adult beetles or the worms and report back to the list? Flying squirrels often build their nests completely out of the fine outer bark of Eastern Red Cedar trees and these nests are often polluted with hundreds if not thousands of fleas. From: Tree Greenwood [mailto:doctree"at"crosslink.net] Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 4:17 PM Subject: Re: Nest Material and Insecticides (Fred's original) On Fri 24 Feb 2006 at 21:37, Fred Vroom <fqvroom"at"comcast.net> wrote: Hi, Fred & the rest of the list, Do I recommend? No. But I do sprinkle cedar shavings in the bottom of boxes, then add a layer of straw twisted into a nest-like bowl. > Do you think cedar shavings reduce pests such as mites, flies and Not in my experience. They are supposed to repel moths. > Where can you get cedar shavings? Any pet store or the pet section of sundry stores like Wal-Mart. I get the coarse shavings and avoid the finer cedar bedding. > Checking Lowes, Home Depot and Garden Centers, I found some possible Both cypress mulch and sphagnum hold moisture. I would use neither. Shredded tires? Not me. > ... I am considering using pyrethrines 0.02% and Peperonyl Butoxide I use a quarter teaspoon of Sevin under the nest material in my Martin houses when I see an infestation of blow fly larvae or mites. I used it last year in one Martin house when I lowered it and my arms were immediately covered with tiny red mites. The hatchlings in all four of the occupied compartments in that house were also covered with the mites. All the hatchlings survived and fledged and I took a hot shower. I have a Tupperware salt shaker in my monitoring box (formerly held kitty litter) with powered Sevin sealed inside. I've never used it in a cavity other than the Purple Martin house where I found a serious problem. _BUT_ my Martin colony is relatively small and new. I will offer 48 cavities for Martins this year if I get the new house put up, otherwise R J 'Tree' Greenwood From: Tree Greenwood [mailto:doctree"at"crosslink.net] Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 6:17 PM Subject: Re: Nest Material and Insecticides (Keith's reply) On Sat 25 Feb 2006 at 11:14, Keith Kridler <txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net> wrote, in part: Keith and group, I agree that thin shavings hold water. Coarse shavings, too. But coarse shavings won't matt down and dry quickly. Moss? Chickadees like it. > Would someone who has these test to see if cedar shavings will kill Cedar doesn't kill. It's supposed to repel. It does NOT repel beetles, in my observations, and definitely doesn't kill 'em. It does repel some types of moths, the reason cedar is used in chests and closets where woolens are stored. > Pine needles probably hold the least amount of moisture of any In my experience, I occasionally see eggs laid or, more correctly, dropped on the bare floor of a birdhouse. The female bird will bring in bits of nesting material but can't build a nest under the egg that she dropped on the bare floor so it just stays there unless or until a monitor intervenes. Female birds, including Bluebirds, that are driven from a nest during the time period that they are actively laying MUST lay the developed egg. If she doesn't, she will become 'egg bound' and die. The most common cause of egg binding is poor diet, especially a lack of calcium. I try to keep egg shells or 'chicken scratch' (pulverized oyster shells) out for birds, especially during nesting season. > Some people believe that a partial covering of nesting material Perhaps true for solitary nesters like Bluebirds and Tree Swallows. Colony nesters like Purple Martins want the company of others. Mirrors and decoys, human-built nests and smearing mud at the entrance to compartments are just a few of the common ways to convince young Purple Martins looking for a home site that they found a place where they'll have company. > Other research shows that bluebirds PREFER an old nest left in a Personally, I try to always put something that's suitable for the species on the bottom of the compartment; wood shavings topped with saw dust for Kestrels and Owls, some straw spun into a bowl for songbirds and Swallows. So why do I sprinkle in some cedar shavings? I have a bale of it left from when a grown daughter had ferrets. On the chance that it might repel some pests, I still use it on the bottom of nest boxes rather than toss it all into the compost bin. > Insecticides in nestboxes: Treat your nestboxes if and when you have a But humans, especially apartment dwellers, pay exterminators to routinely spray for cockroaches and other pests. > There are MANY different pyrethroids ..[snipped to...] Definitely true. Also, the eggs of parasitic wasps need a protected place to survive the winter. In nature, that would be a natural cavity where the wasp eggs would remain in the nest. So we also destroy the nests when we clean out nestboxes... > ... Many pests live on the birds constantly and will not be in contact Buy beneficial fly predators instead of chemicals. The previous owner of our rural home used Ortho products for every perceived problem. No bugs of any kind were allowed to survive, especially icky spiders as well as ants, flies ... and all the beneficial insects. I bought a package deal of a variety of beneficial insects the spring after we moved in -- trichograma wasps, lady beetles and praying mantis. Over 20 years later, we have a natural populations of all those critters around every year. We even watch for the egg clusters as we prune and protect them from excessive heat, cold and WOODPECKERS that love to feast on every praying mantis or walkingstick egg cluster that they find. It is fun to watch a Flicker at the feast, though. Looks like we agree on principles but disagree on some details, Keith. Typical for the Bluebird list. Take care, R J 'Tree' Greenwood From: Denise [mailto:maltmomma"at"alltel.net] Hi all, my 5 babies have fledged and my nestbox is nasty. The inside has bird droppings and I also noticed these tiny (I mean specks) of what I thought was dirt but they moved! I'm assuming this may be some type of mite? How do I clean the box to get all the droppings off and kill the mites without hurting the birds for future nestings? I discard the nest, don't I? Thanks y'all. From: mrtony8 [mailto:philip.berry"at"mchsi.com] I use a stiff brush and a weak solution of bleach water. No problems. From: Torrey [mailto:torrey_canyon"at"yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2006 11:56 PM Subject: not a paper wasp Hi everybody, I found something very interesting while checking half my trail yesterday. There was a hornet-looking thing (not a paper wasp) in an empty box, which i shooed out. Then i noticed a mud "coccoon" on the inside wall of the nestbox. I removed it & didn't take any pictures, both actions which i regret now. Anyways, inside the mud coccoon was a large yellowish larva, looking just like a typical grub. My first thought was that it was a mud dauber coccoon, but it wasn't the right shape & didn't have any dead feeder bugs in with it. I didn't notice it last week, but i'm not going to swear it wasn't there. Anybody have any ideas what it was? The mud coccoon was smaller than my thumbnail but bigger than my pinkie nail, slightly oblong, & had kind of a stalk at the top. Thanks, Torrey PS As of my box checks on Apr 15 & 18, 24 out of 115 boxes have active EABL nests, meaning at least 1 egg One box had a mouse nest with tiny pink babies, which i saw when i tossed so i carefully put the nest back. Torrey Wenger From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2006 9:26 AM Subject: Re: not a paper wasp Keith Kridler Mt.Pleasant, Texas I call what Torrey found a "Potters Wasp" because it makes tiny mud containers to put food in to raise a single young wasp or hornet. This insect looks like a miniature hornet in color but the wings are held at a slightly different angle when at rest. We find them building in all sorts of places and they will sometimes build under a gap in wood siding on a house. This is another one of Gods creatures that is truly amazing. They take little dabs of mud and create water tight pots or jugs that are basically round but with a flat bottom. When they go to seal off the pot they taper it off and place a small neck on the pot but then they normally add a rim to the neck so it looks like a tiny hand could reach out, grasp the neck of the pot and have a solid rim to grip and then use this to lift up the pot from where the wasp stuck it. This makes no sense at all because the young wasp when it hatches out chews out a small hole in the side of the pot and then it looks like a miniature birdhouse gourd. They sometimes line up a whole row of these pots in a single line sometimes you find them sitting in a group. Most of the time the pot maker only lives long enough to build two or three of these and leave them behind. I feel early humans observed wild creatures and if you look at the pottery vessels that the vanished Indian tribes of the South Western states, the Anastasia, used to carry water and store grain to protect it from insects and rodents you will see that they are large copies of the tiny "Potters Wasp" creations. Indians planted corn in "hills" and the Mexican farmers today still plant 10 seeds in a small 1 foot circle then plant 3 climbing beans or cow peas in the circle and move down 3 to 4 feet and plant another clump or circle of corn. They call these hills because they dug up only this small circle and fluffed up soil leaves a mound or hill. Anyway if you watch yellow shafted flickers they will steal a whole mouthful of sunflowers or whole corn and they carry this off to a spot in the yard or field and they bury the whole batch of corn in a "hill". I will almost bet you that 10,000 years ago a flicker in Mexico stole a mouthful of Maize and a few peas or beans and showed the Mayan or Inca's how to plant two of their main crops in their gardens... Hang gliders have copied the flying squirrels. ... You can watch the bluebirds all day long but if you want to be truly amazed borrow a microscope and study one of their wing feathers up close and personal. If you want to learn something from your children or grand children give them a digital camera that will take close up pictures and tell them to go out and shoot everything they like.
... http://www.cirrusimage.com/bees_wasps_potter.htm Dang I thought I made up the name potter wasp. This is the species we see in From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net] Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas Depending on the color of the outside of the nestbox and the size of the insects and the time of year in the location of the nestbox the insects very well could have been Thrips and not lice or mites. Thrips are a sucking insect that feed on tender plants, they LOVE different colors of flowers. There are also some very tiny gray insects that feed on decomposing vegetable matter (old damp bird nests) and these are very similar in size to a thrip but a beautiful dark mouse gray color. They will swarm together in moving clumps, normally right at ground level but I don't believe they can fly. They can "spring" or hop remarkable distances for their tiny size. KK From: L. Field [mailto:gabriel"at"kendra.com] Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 10:31 AM Subject: Re: tiny insects swarming the nestbox/Lice removal Oh I am so happy that I can contribute something here. I recently rescued a beautiful indian fantail pigeon from a neighbors' yard. I would assume that you could wash out an old nest box with the water/borax mix and that every single louse (even in a crevice) would die. That's what I'll do if I find myself in a similar situation re: Lynn From: RBALTRUNAS"at"cs.com [mailto:RBALTRUNAS"at"cs.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 10:05 AM Subject: OT: Bird Mites? Help!
we are having a problem, a very serious problem. 2 months ago we began feeling like fleas were jumping onto our legs in our apartment. We applied flea sprays and powders. But these are either the world's tiniest fleas or some kind of mites. I left my parrot outside often in Nov-Dec. he may have brought them in or they got i some other way. These things are too tiny to see. It is maddening to feel them and not see them. Worse yet, nothing seems to kill them off. Has anyone encountered such thing? Are there bird mites that can jump and are super tiny? Anyone have any rememdies for fleas or mites? We have tried 3 sprays and 2 powders and one bomb and they kill off most them they rebound. We have used flea sprays with insect growth regulators and these have had no effect. This is horrible. Anyone have any knowledge or ideas for good sprays with residual killing power? Ron Clearwater, Fl From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 11:23 PM Subject: Re: Bird Mites? There is a chance you have an insect called a thrip. They are tiny and can fly. Although they are typically a plant pest they do bite when they land on humans. Mites and lice normally just crawl and would not be that hard to kill. Thrip are normally a warm season insect but are attracted to light colored clothes and will be attracted to towels and sheets hanging on a clothes line.
For something like this that seems to have invaded your house you might want to purchase the automatic fly sprayers that are battery powered and give out a small burst of insecticide every fifteen minutes or so.
Country Vet is one that is sold at Tractor Supply companies. They use a weak dose of Permethrin that would be useful for killing thrip, mites, lice or fleas. You can move these around several times a day to cover different areas of different rooms. These are registered for use in houses and restaurants.
You should be able to buy a soap or shampoo formulated for head lice at most stores and these would work on whatever is getting on you also. Keith Kridler
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